Hello. Can someone tell me what are pros and cons for going pro (HU sng) poker player. How much should i earn per month. Is it ok if i earn twice as much as if i would when i went to work in my country? Can swings "kill" my poker career, what to do of not going busto (yeah i know proper BR, but something more about it maybe).
Any good books about going pro and what to be careful of. How many +$ months should i have before even considering this (not that whole month would be -$ for me anyway)?
Hope i made it clear enough. Thanks in advance for responses :)
hey bud, just have a minute so im gonna write up a quick response:
pros: great money, freedom of time and life, able to work from anywhere
cons: very STRESSFUL at time, not always understood by others/the public
things to make sure of:
make SURE you've established a solid win-rate, I don't know what your life situation is but I would say you should have been beating the limit you want to be your main limit at first for ~3 months minimum, and beating HU in general ~6 months minimum
USE BR MANAGEMENT, if your just going pro and havent looked into it alot, I would NOT be playing on <50-75 BI until I really got comfortable with playing full time and all the extras that come with it
best of luck, let me know if you have any questions about what I said, or to me specifically,
-Primo
If you want to be a pro, dont expect to "earn twice as much as if i would when i went to work in my country". Variations are very high even if you beat a game. You should be mentally prepared for swings, even if you have enough bankroll.
I know one book called "Poker Pro" by Roy Rounder, you can Google for it and download. I believe this book is mostly about offline poker, but possibly you will find something for you.
If you're going to go pro there's only two ways I've seen that have anywhere near a decent success rate:
1) Being incredibly gifted and talented, meaning if you went to college for 4 years or whatever and got the requisite degree, you'd own the hell out of whatever field you entered. People like this that work hard don't really need to hear this, they are already making a shit ton of money in poker and would be no matter what did.
2) Going about it responsibly. Taking out money for taxes quarterly (bcm talks about this in his blog sometimes), having 6-12 months of living expenses (rent, food, entertainment, etc.) set aside BEFORE going pro and having a clear cut, realistic plan for going pro. The plan needs to include playing time, tilt prevention, possible coaching and advice from other players (maybe a % of your br set aside for regular coaching to stay sharp and keep focused), game selection/buyin levels and things like healthy living, diet, excercise and mental stability. You should really talk to some other pros about your specific plan before you go pro. You should, however, figure what you want and how you plan to accomlish it on your own, that way it is original and for YOU, not somebody else's idea. Use other experts to help shape, mold and tell you what is unrealistic or wrong about your plan, rather than using them to actually make a plan. Think of poker peers as your editors, if you're not capable of making a plan on your own, you're not ready to be a professional poker player.
Now, if you don't follow plan two, you can still be a successful pro. Most successful husng "pros" that I know don't even follow #2. At this point in my life I'm not ready to do that 100%, so I'm not going to try to become a pro. It's not shameful, it's realistic. People often get caught up in the drama of being "free" to play whenever you want and the big sessions they can book or the big months they can have. Unfortunately, a lot of these guys end up broke or end up unhappy in life. Even some of the biggest husng winners aren't really saving that much money. A lot of them have no long term plan in case they don't keep up with the general progression of the games, or worse yet get tired of poker. Many more don't even enjoy short term success bc they blow all their money on things that depreciate rather quickly.
If you want to go pro, do it right. Formulate your plan and ask as many successful people as you can about it. Ignore the stuff about "other people don't understand poker." If you do shit right and know how to talk to other people, the smart and realistic people will understand what you do for a living. Even if they don't get all the specifics, it's a two way street and poker players can be some of the most naive and ignorant of all, which is ironic considering all the "omg what do you do when someone asks you what you do for a living" dramatic bullshit I hear constantly. Good luck, but it's not a game, it's life. Treat it as such.
thanks :) i think i will wait several months before making a final decision. I kinda dont have that "real life plan" yet.
i am really good tilt resistant, being down 15 buyins in a day or several hours isnt that much of a big deal for me. But it's true i dont play on high stakes. I rather go middle stakes and do them massively. Like 100 per day when i have time was not so much of a big problem.
Now i see there is a lot more, than just being worried u dont go busto (which still remains No.1 problem) and enjoying the life and not caring at anything. I kinda looked at it as a going through day per day. So thanks for your responses guys. i was kinda naive it can be so simple huh?
I totally support Ryan's thoughts. You should have a sound bullet proof plan for this. Think about tomorrow. Really depends on your individual case but you may ask yourself one of the following questions: I'm I going to get married dome day? Have kids? pay housing bills? buy a car? pay taxes? pay for children's education? daycare? traveling and entertainment? will poker not get boring? ... the list goes on.
Thing is, if you turn a pro, everything may run well for some time, but things change in time, we ourselves change. You must be mentally prepared and always come up with a plan. IMO, turning a poker pro is a new career, you must weigh all long term life plans, habits at the best of your ability and have a good picture of how it is all going to fit with your poker plans. All that of course, besides a proper BR, tilt prevention and other attributes of the poker profession.
Wish you all the best!
Saulius
From Rypac's post: "Good luck, but it's not a game, it's life. Treat it as such."
My only comment on this topic is that make sure poker is a job and not a lifestyle. It might be a job where your hours vary based on who's online or what promotions are running, but it's still a job. The more you can separate poker from the rest of your life the better, as far as I know.
I use poker to fill the gaps where I'm not doing anything else. This keeps it from really controlling my life, but then again I probably get 10% of the volume that some of you guys do so maybe I should change it up!
And I do like half the volume you do xSCWx, so I'm in real trouble here!
One last thought. Like I said before, I haven't really made the jump into a full on professional level, both in volume, success or mindset. On the other hand, while I need to become more productive with poker, I've also balanced my real life work and I think that's a pretty good idea for anybody who is considering becoming pro.
Having a few non poker investments is a very good idea (poker investments are fine too, but not as ideal b/c they keep you tied down in the poker world during non poker playing times and can burn you out much easier). Even having a part time job can be very rewarding, other than the consistent income coming in, you may appreciate your seemingly weak $20/hourly in the mid stakes and it may give you some motivation to continue to push your limits to see what you can accomplish. In my experience though, it's much easier to play winning poker and somewhat enjoy it when you have at least one other consistent source of income coming in. People talked about auto workers having risky jobs, now they talk about investment bankers or traders having risky jobs, but the current state of the poker player (especially for American players) includes a lot of built in risk. If you're not making six figures a year from poker and you don't have a lot of money saved, you almost need to start developing other sources of income or you're putting a few years of your life at risk of very low production and less happiness in your life. The time to act is now so you're not reacting to something out of your control later on.