When effective stacks are <10bbs, I've been doing this some and I'm not so sure about this. I've basically just been following the push chart especially against villains who obv. don't understand the concept. Correct or not?
I came across a big big winner in a 4 man and he limped a ton of buttons when he was under 10bbs so I used the Nash push chart and shoved a ton. My question is; Was he limping b/c he didn't have a pushable Nash hand? When I was IP I was following the chart and since this guy was a huge winning supernova he's gotta know what I was doing. So what was his strategy? Was he deviating b/c he knew I was following the chart and was trying to limp unshovable hands to take it down on the flop? But it seemed like a bad strat on his part b/c I was shoving such a wide range on him.
Also should I be limping ip when I don't have a shovable hand? If villain is agro and gonna shove over a good amount then I assume no. If this is the case, maybe I should only limp big hands that I want to induce from?
Anyway, any thoughts on button limping 10bbs or less would be appreciated
TY!!!
especially how to adapt nash pushing ranges to limpers
One time bump
He doesn't have to know what he's doing just bc he's supernova or a big winner, especially if he's a regular speed player.
Regular speed players tend to have worse end games on average (not always true, but on average) b/c they don't get to the end game nearly as often as a turbo speed player, making the end game a little less important for them.
I can think of at least a few six figure winners who have atrocious end games right now, some turbo players, though maybe a couple of these guys cleaned their end game up in the last 6-12 months, I don't rail often.
As to your strategy question about Nash and facing a limp, I've heard of people doing different things when facing a limp. These are the 4 options I hear most from winning players:
- Use Nash BB calling ranges for your effective stacks and push anything that you would call a shove with.
- Use Nash SB pushing ranges, so you'd be pushing a little wider.
- Shove just about everything (this is usually vs a more transparent opponent who keeps limping even though you're shoving and they keep folding... sometimes turns into a guessing game if you're not thick skinned).
- Shove very little (most guys that tell me this will turn the discussion into "well we can steal a lot of flops anyways" when I press them on this strategy, a valid point but not necessarily applicable to every player).
I'd personally just recommend using 1 or 2, depending on the type of opponent you are playing, combined with a good post flop strategy your end game should be better than just about every opponent you face.
The problem with using Nash against limps is that most opponents are going to be limping a somewhat polarized range (weak hands and hands that they want you to shove into, like aces). Nash isn't designed for something like this so it won't be optimal against most players' limping ranges.
What I would suggest is using Nash as a guideline for relative hand strength (like I think that 87hh probably has significantly more equity than J3o against their range if they call you). The important thing to consider is how often you think they are limping good hands though. If they are only limp/folding then you can profitably shove any two. If they are a reg and suddenly limp while like 8BB deep then there is a good chance that they are ONLY doing this with strong hands, although I have seen quite a few players limp/fold even while this shallow against me.