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ready2win's picture
$5 Turbo: Turn decision with low straight vs aggressive villian

Hand is prob total std but not sure

 

Not a lot od history against villian, this is our second match

VPIP is 57%, he never c/c flop, he either c/r (most of the times) or leads

I think just flatting flop is fine to let him hand himseelf. Turn is not the best card in the deck but can we fold here against his c/r rly? 

IPoker Network No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t10.00/t20.00 Blinds - 2 players
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

Hero (BTN/SB): t1300.00 65 BBs
BB: t1700.00 85 BBs

Pre Flop: (t30) Hero is BTN/SB with A 4
Hero raises to t60, BB calls t40

Flop: (t120) 5 2 3 (2 players)
BB bets t120.00, Hero calls t120

Turn: (t360) 4 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets t270.00BB raises to t585, Hero?

 

Thanks! 

aggresionware's picture
If you're flatting to let him

If you're flatting to let him hang himself why are you then thinking about folding when he check raises big? How many hands with a 6 do you think are in his range, his vpip may be 57 but is that nearly all IP? I don't think I'm folding here, I think it's more likely that he has Ax and you're chopping than he has a six and you're getting about 4:1 on a call. Of course you're pretty much committed to the hand if you call, but I'm not sure about shoving over his check raise cause if he does have you beat he's definitely calling, and if he doesn't he's folding so if you could get to showdown without putting anymore chips in the pot that would seem to be +ev to me, but difficult to achieve.  So basically I'm as confused as you (probably more) and hope someone who knows what they're talking about can shed some light on the subject :)

arh7rf's picture
I think that this hand has

I think that this hand has been misplayed IMO. You don't have a lot of info on this opponent, you only said that you flatted the flop in order to let villain hang himself... what is the read that you have in order to justifuy this?Flop... RAISE. I don't know how often he donks but this flop is a clear RAISE. You don't want your opponent to find a reason not to put his entire stack in as more cards come.Turn. You bet WAY to big. There are 4 cards to a straight. What is going to call a 3/4 pot bet on this street? 1/2 pot is the most you want to bet here. Checking back and bluff catching the river or value betting the river depending on his line and the final card. I would never suggest trying to get the money in trying to get him to it in with a worse hand.This is going to sound crazy but readless, this is a fold. Against most opponents, this is a fold. Unfortunate, I know. Baluga Theorem is in action here. Turn check raises are like 90% the nuts or damn close.Good luck. Feel free to critique my critique.

ready2win's picture
@ aggresionware 1) Because he

@ aggresionware1) Because he is def able to double donk bet but his c/r confused me a bit.2) Sorry, I dont understand this question... @arh7rf1) he donk bets about half of the time so far2) I aggre that my bet is too big here and that I should bet around 1/2 pot like you said. This is not really a spot for Baluga Theorem but I understand what you mean.

arh7rf's picture
What do you mean this isn't

What do you mean this isn't baluga theorem? Baluga theorom has to do with turn check raises. This is a turn check raise. Explain why its not.

ready2win's picture
obv it has to do with turn

obv it has to do with turn c/r but in a very specific situation:

"You should strongly re-evaluate the stength of one-pair hands in the face of a raise on the turn".

So Baluga doesnt rly apply here as you can see.

Using it in a wider context meaning c/r on the turns are most of the times strong hands (or what villian consider a strong hand) you are right and I agreed already with you about that.

aggresionware's picture
I don't think the baluga

I don't think the baluga theorem makes this a fold. Ready2win's right that the baluaga theorem's meant to refer to single pair hands, which are almost certainly crushed on a board like this. I don't think the 5 high straight is crushed too often. I was just asking how loose he was out of position, as theirs not too many hands with a 6 in them that I'd play from the big blind. But if he plays half his hands from the big blind then there's a much higher chance he has a 6. 

arh7rf's picture
Facing this action, your the

Facing this action, your the wheel on that board is basically AK on an AQ9x with 2 to a suit facing a check raise. Its a 1 pair hand.

ready2win's picture
However you do realise that

However you do realise that AK on AQ9x is like the 15th nuts on that board and here we have the 3rd nuts (even it is on a very coordinated board)

arh7rf's picture
Yea but because of the way

Yea but because of the way the boards are there is not as much difference between the two scenarios as both hands absolute strength suggests. Its all relative.

longjohn's picture
Not sure about the turn

Not sure about the turn, but I think that the flop is a definite raise you need 2 bets here if you want to get it in by the river and you haven't said about any read on him carrying on barreling after donking the flop.If your not raising his donk here then what sort of range would you be raising his donks with, just out of curiosity?