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th1986's picture
Sample Size , ROI , When to move up?

Great site guys!

Pretty strange because i woke up a few mornings ago feeling sick of the regular SNG grind (I 15 table lower limit 18 man SNG's , $16-$38 range pretty much full time).

Decided to switch things up and grind some HUSNG's for a few hours , and while browsing 2p2 came across the ad in the coaching section , signed up immediatly. Hopefully i can improve and start adding these in a lot more , because it's a great change of pace from what I'm use to.

 

Anyways , enough rambling my questions are

1) What is a solid sample size , at one particular level to get an idea of your true ROI

2) At what point should you move up? I.E. , over x amount of games at x buyin I have x ROI , so i should move up a level. Hope that makes sense.

3) What is a ideal ROI , for different levels? I suppose sense I'm starting right at the $23s-$33s , a idea of ideal ROI's at those levels would be what i want to know most.

 

Thanks for any help i get!

 

 

th1986's picture
 Oh , and any advice on how

 Oh , and any advice on how to set up my HUD for HUSNG's?
Didn't notice the any of the instructers using them in the video's i watched so maybe it's not all that important. 
I have hold em manager to btw if anyone has any advice about setting up my hud a certain way.

RyPac13's picture
I'll try to tackle some of

I'll try to tackle some of this for you:
 

1) What is a solid sample size , at one particular level to get an idea of your true ROI
It all depends on your winrate.  With a winrate of 65% you need maybe a few hundred games to figure out how good you are with any degree of certainty, with a winrate of 52% it could take thousands of games.  Generally speaking, take your results seriously, but don't harp on them.  Just bc you were a 10% winner in the 22s and are now a 1% winner in the 33s doesn't mean competition is much tougher or you aren't that good.  You could very well be running above average in 22s and below in 33s.



I personally had about 2-3x the ROI success in 33s as 11-22s, briefly hit the 55s then stayed in 110s with a meager winning ROI for over a thousand games, before finally 2 tabling with a solid edge in those games.  I often lost sight of what I should be focused on, improving my play.  Please learn from myself and others mistakes in this area and just play and work to improve as much as possible, taking winrate into consideration for bankroll management and as a factor in how well you are doing.  But don't base your success and happiness on a winrate at any certain level after xxx games.
2) At what point should you move up? I.E. , over x amount of games at x buyin I have x ROI , so i should move up a level. Hope that makes sense.
Take shots when you are comfortable and within your bankroll guidelines.

It's tough to give you any formula for being "correct" bc there really is none.  It's so player dependent.

I generally like to make sure of a few things when moving up:

1) I have the bankroll to move up.  If I don't have the bankroll to move up, there's no point in even moving down the line here.

2) I have been emotionally stable.  Little to no tilt sessions, little to no frustration lately with games.  Kind of ties into..

3) I am playing my best.  My instincts are confident and mostly correct and I feel like I am playing to the best of my ability often.

4) Not only do I have the bankroll to move up, but I can handle losing x dollars and I have no problem moving back down and winning at a high level if I do lose money moving up.  This is a tough one for most people.  Good players can take shots higher up, lose money and move down.  Great players can take shots at high levels, lose money, move down and continue to play their best so that they can take another shot as soon as possible.
3) What is a ideal ROI , for different levels? I suppose sense I'm starting right at the $23s-$33s , a idea of ideal ROI's at those levels would be what i want to know most.
For turbo speeds, I'd shoot for 5% or higher as a target at any given level for low to mid stakes.  Be careful about setting unrealistic goals or about staying at one level too long just because "you want to get to x% ROI."  These are mostly mental tricks for the weak, even if you see very successful players using them, they are just cheating themselves of their true potential.  If it looks stupid and silly it most likely is.  There isn't really a magic formula for when to move up or when to stop playing poker, anybody who tells you so is probably lying to you.