Hi
Any chance of getting a vid or an article that focuses on the following specific areas, there was another thread asking about articles people might like to see but i cant find it now.
Im interested in seeing a video or series of videos that shows what levels of thinking are needed and how these can be applied at different stakes from small - medium. It would be good to get an explanation as to what is meant by this term as well, ive read slanksys (sp?) definition but also heard contradictions to this. It would be good to see this in action.
Secondly id like to see something on interpreting bet sizes and being able to use that information later in a game, i guess this comes up in most videos from time to time but a vid zooooming in on this particular area would really help.
And finally an article on interpreting board textures would be cool i think it should mix in well with bet sizing too e.g. flop 247 fish donks pot, turn k, fish min bets, river j, fish min bets is usually a 7 or something like that.
Something like this possible?
cheers
Oli
Board textures - Yes, we should've had something like this out a long time ago. That's our fault for sure, it's an area that should be covered by a site like our's. I'll probably try to get Skates to do this one, he was always very good at articulating board texture in my experiences.
Bet sizing - Tough one. As you touch on, this is covered here and there in videos as it comes up. This might be more doable as an article. I can see the logistics of doing this in a video being pretty tough, but perhaps a short video (maybe even a follow up short video or two) on this would be manageable. I'm just trying to think of ways to accomplish what needs to be said and discussed in an efficient manner on this one.
Moving up - I think this would almost certainly have to be an article. I think this site is really getting to the point to where we're stressing the right mindset to beat any level game right from the start of your learning experience. Videos we cover from the $100-200 ranges are really letting $5 players understand what it takes to think well about husng poker. Because, while you can build a winning style strictly for the low level games, and probably in the most short term efficient way, long term you're better off just learning how to think about the entire game in a much more viable (and ultimately more efficient) way.
What I mean to say, is that there aren't any major secrets as you move up. People usually just develop basic skills like position, value betting, basic end game, and so on first. So in turn, they have enough to beat the lower levels. As they move up, more advanced skills are needed and have to be refined to beat those games.
But if you start on day 1 working hard, studying the game, thinking in a productive way about every decision you make and really not forcing yourself to think inside of a box, then you're going to be developing every skill that you need to beat any level.
Basically, if I tell a player to raise 3x from 50-75bbs, 2.5x from 30-50bbs and 2x from 10-30bbs, then shove or fold 10bb or less, he'll be a stronger preflop player on his button than 95% of the guys at the low stakes.
But if I tell that player how to adjust his preflop raise sizes to what his opponent is doing, how to recognize and adjust and exploit what his opponent is doing, he'll have the tools necessary to be a top PF button player in all of the games.
The last paragraph takes longer to learn, but it allows the player to understand what he needs to learn and improve upon to beat any level game. The first is just a basic, easy to read idea that allows them to be superior in a certain area of the game (PF button play) at the low buyins.
Now, I discounted some more advanced stuff that does apply here, mainly reacting to 3bets and open ranges, but I used a simplistic example because I think it better gets my point across: General level by level adjustments or advice is a little overrated, the thought process behind becoming a growing and dangerous player is much more important and relevant.
It's also why the question of "what's the difference between x buyin and the next level?" gets answered with "not much, regs are slightly better" just about everytime by good players.
So, in short, board texture video = priority, bet sizes being related to reads later on in the game = we'll look into something specific, but continue to highlight this during regular videos and moving up in buyin level videos = maybe an article or a series of interviews asking these kinds of questions from different pros that aren't featured on our site (I have an interview I have to edit to post on the site from one person that qualifies as that btw).
Let me know if you have any other thoughts, questions or suggestions. They are most appreciated and definitely help us improve the site for all of us.
Hey Ryan,
while we're at it: from time to time we see Villain check-call the flop and donk the turn. I always find this donkbet hard to interpretate. From my experience it is (depending on the betsize as well) often a blocking bet with a turned draw or turned 2 pair. I think I have NEVER seen a coach doing this...can you think of situations where it would be advisable to do so? By your experience, on what range do you put Villain if he ck-calls flop, donks turn? Sorry to be so general, I am aware of that fact that it depends on many factors such as stacksize, opponent and metagame, but this is also a situation that isn't covered too much in the vids.
Hope that doesn't go too far into private coaching ;-)
Thanx!
Martin
When semi bluffing vs a guy that won't get too out of line, ch/call, lead turn (missing your draw) works out well sometimes. You absolutely prefer a fold, your opponent is often too weak to call (board texture applies, in a very big way vs some) and you preserved all of that air in his range by calling his flop cbet. You also saw the turn cheap, and if he flat calls (works well against a passive or a player that only raises with pretty strong hands, though I prefer the passive on average) you have a nice pot built and some outs to get more value on.
Now, that's pretty general. You could have showdown value with a K hi type draw vs a passive guy that won't double barrel without a very strong hand. You're probably better off checking and taking free cards vs his mid to weak made hands, getting to showdown super cheap. There's other exceptions too, but think about that instance a bit.
For value, against a loose-passive that doesn't know a value bet without the nuts (hu nuts, which really means like TP to me) you can check/call a higher cbet % player (more common) with something like KT on a 58K board. Turn is a T, you're not getting another bet if you check from anything but Kx+ here, so you lead and he will make loose calls with all the straight draws out there, weaker pairs and flush draws (if they are there).
Those are two general scenarios that come to mind. I think I use this line here and there in my videos, but you need some specific reads I think to do this (simlar to donk betting, though donk betting even more so on average) more than rarely in games.
The main thing is, that if you misapply this stuff in the game, you're often making a bad play. You're OOP, and a lot of times when you build a pot OOP and you're wrong for doing so, you're wrong in a pretty big way. Not only have you made a bad decision on the turn, but because you did the river pot is much bigger and you are still OOP, only now more committed to a pot that shouldn't have been built so big.
Same applies to the donk betting, except you're on the flop, so you have the potential to really muck the hand up.
Just really think about your opponent, feel like you have a good idea of what he does with various hands on various turns and rivers, what he'll bet, what he'll check, what he'll call vs a lead, and so on. If you can't do that well, don't donk bet nor check/call lead the turn yet. But work on thinking about your opponent in that way and sooner than later a situation will come up that it feels obvious to you that donk betting or check/calling and leading the turn is the best possible play. Then go for it.
Cheers Rypac, Skates articles are always quality, i especially like it when he says something like " do you get what i mean" or "do you understand" and i always think, nope... better read it again.. and again... :)
I'll look forward to seeing something on flop texture i guess it will fit nicely into the medium to advanced packs that are already out there. (just editing to add, flop texture in relation to villains assumed range :) )
In hindsight the bit on using bet sizing tells might best be done by the viewers of the vids, as we agree the info is in a lot of vids already and it would probably be a good learning/reinforcement exercise to cut out examples of this that are already in the vids and edit it into a single vid. Kind of like a betsizing remix. Maybe pulling out 5 or 6 specific examples for a single vid. Im ridiculously busy with work at the moment but it should die down after next weekend.... ill see if i can take this on and do something around it, it will be beneficial for me after all... does it sound like a good idea?
i'll keep thinking about other stuff, really just being selfish and asking for things that puzzle me with the game :)